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Post by shred on Feb 23, 2012 20:48:11 GMT
Notlaw,
Welcome to the forum.
Many thanks for supplying the information on your findings. After looking at the 1911 census I would be a lot more confident with opting for your man. I have highlighted my post (number 6) to show this.
Thanks again.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2012 9:58:22 GMT
SWDGW SHOW THIS. BANNISTER Harold Parkinson Birth: Barrow-In-Furness, Lancs Pte. 9823 Manchester Regiment
Herbert Richard BANNISTER Rank: C.S.M. Birth: Barrow-In-Furness, Lancs Residence: Eccles, Lancs Enlisted: Manchester Manchester Regiment 2/7th Battalion. Number: 275655 Date died: 21 March 1918 Son of Richard and Alice Bannister, of 46, Pleasant Rd., Eccles, Lancs.
You may get more info off the Manchester regiment forum?
Ben
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Post by notlaw on Feb 24, 2012 16:50:01 GMT
Hi-Re Harold Bannister. I now have a problem and without being pedantic I'm just trying to get the right man without causing offence to anyone!! The Harold Bannister originally posted I have traced in the 1911 Census as Living and Bank House, Manchester Road Swinton in the parish of St Peter. It shows Harold's place of birth as Pendleton. The census shows his father George aged 59 and married for the past 11 years to Agnes his 2nd wife. His occupation is Railway Audit Clerk and his place of birth is Accrington. The 1901 Census shows the family unit living at the same address and the 1891 census shows the family living at 91 Manchester Road Swinton, which I think is still in the parish of St Peter George is now married to his 1st wife Mary Eliz, The 1881 Census shows George living at 41 Rockley Street Pendleton in the parish of St Thomas. He is single, birth place is Accrington and his occupation is Audit Clerk Railway. So it's still the same man. looking at the census' for 1871 and 1861 George can be traced back to his birthplace in Accrington. In view of the above and fact there is no evidence that either the family or Harold specifically had any connection with St Andrew Eccles, is it reasonable to assume this is not the correct man? If on the other hand both Harold Parkinson and Herbert Richard Bannister are commemorated in the Eccles Wesleyan Chapel, is it possible, probable or likely that the two men are commemorated in both places? My searches show Harold living at 1901 Barton Lane and Herbert Richard living at 46 pleasant Road both od which are in the parish of St Andrew's.
Your advise would be appreciated.
Notlaw
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Post by notlaw on Feb 24, 2012 17:36:31 GMT
Hi Gary - The William Bruce is, I think, the right person and the attachment shows some photos of his grave in the Cairo Cemetery. I hope you agree with me this is very well kept and all credit must go to the excellent work of the gardeners. Notlaw. Attachments:
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Post by shred on Feb 24, 2012 18:01:00 GMT
Hi-Re Harold Bannister. I now have a problem and without being pedantic I'm just trying to get the right man without causing offence to anyone!! The Harold Bannister originally posted I have traced in the 1911 Census as Living and Bank House, Manchester Road Swinton in the parish of St Peter. It shows Harold's place of birth as Pendleton. The census shows his father George aged 59 and married for the past 11 years to Agnes his 2nd wife. His occupation is Railway Audit Clerk and his place of birth is Accrington. The 1901 Census shows the family unit living at the same address and the 1891 census shows the family living at 91 Manchester Road Swinton, which I think is still in the parish of St Peter George is now married to his 1st wife Mary Eliz, The 1881 Census shows George living at 41 Rockley Street Pendleton in the parish of St Thomas. He is single, birth place is Accrington and his occupation is Audit Clerk Railway. So it's still the same man. looking at the census' for 1871 and 1861 George can be traced back to his birthplace in Accrington. In view of the above and fact there is no evidence that either the family or Harold specifically had any connection with St Andrew Eccles, is it reasonable to assume this is not the correct man? If on the other hand both Harold Parkinson and Herbert Richard Bannister are commemorated in the Eccles Wesleyan Chapel, is it possible, probable or likely that the two men are commemorated in both places? My searches show Harold living at 1901 Barton Lane and Herbert Richard living at 46 pleasant Road both od which are in the parish of St Andrew's. Your advise would be appreciated. Notlaw Notlaw, Sorry for the late reply I work full time, as do the rest of the admin team. Please do not feel that you will upset anyone by offering an alternative to any of the men posted. Some of the men can be very difficult to pin down and help to do so is always gratefully appreciated. I will review all the details that you have provided later this evening and post my thoughts. That said the only definitive way to prove which Bannisters are commemorated where is by finding any articles that were printed in the Eccles Journal after their deaths were reported.... hoping that there is a reference within the article to which church they were a parishioner of.
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Post by shred on Feb 24, 2012 18:06:58 GMT
Hi Gary - The William Bruce is, I think, the right person and the attachment shows some photos of his grave in the Cairo Cemetery. I hope you agree with me this is very well kept and all credit must go to the excellent work of the gardeners. Notlaw. The gardeners who look after all our CWGC cemeteries do a wonderful job of taking care of them, some under very difficult circumstances. Our thanks should go out to them all.
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Post by shred on Feb 24, 2012 19:26:02 GMT
Hi Gary - The William Bruce is, I think, the right person and the attachment shows some photos of his grave in the Cairo Cemetery. I hope you agree with me this is very well kept and all credit must go to the excellent work of the gardeners. Notlaw. Notlaw, Mack has indicated that this is the correct William Bruce in reply 19 of this thread. Still working on the Bannisters, back soon.
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Post by shred on Feb 24, 2012 19:52:53 GMT
I would be confident that the Herbert Richard Bannister living at 46 Pleasent Road is the same man as inscribed on the St Andrew's and Eccles Wesleyan memorials (I have attached a copy of Herbert's will). I do not find the fact that he is commemorated on two different church memorials improbable at all.... one of his relations may have put his name forward at the church that they worshipped at, this may prove to be the case if he was Harold's cousin. i.e. Harold's parents put Herbert's name forward at St Andrews and Herbert's parents do the same at Eccles Wesleyan (or visa versa). The two Bannisters may have attended the Wesleyan church so were include but lived in the parish of St Andrew's so were included on that memorial too. The committees set up to collect names for memorials set their own criteria of who and why names would be included. We have an index which seems to cover most of the men reported in the Eccles Journal from 1915 to 1917 salfordwarmemorials.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=pics&action=display&thread=1397 . Unfortunately Harold Bannister of the Manchester Regiment is not included in the index, so a report may not have been published. There may be one for Herbert though, I will check when I visit the library next Wednesday. It would be great if we can make a definite link between Herbert and Harold. I shall keep searching. Attachments:
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Post by shred on Feb 24, 2012 21:21:53 GMT
Marriages of the mothers ( as you state both Parkinson):
Marriage: 22 Dec 1883 Holy Trinity, Tarleton, Lancashire, England Richard Bannister - 27 Master Mariner Bachelor of Barrow In Furness Alice Parkinson - 24 Spinster of Tarleton Groom's Father: James Bannister, Ship Carpenter Bride's Father: Thomas Parkinson, Labourer Witness: John Bannister; Hannah Lee Married by Licence by: Robert C Fletcher Rector Register: Marriages 1881 - 1909, Page 11, Entry 21 Source: LDS Film 1849640
Marriage: 28 Apr 1883 Holy Trinity, Tarleton, Lancashire, England James Bannister - 33 Mariner Bachelor of Barrow In Furness Ellen Parkinson - 30 Spinster of Tarleton Groom's Father: Hugh Bannister, Ship Carpenter Bride's Father: Thomas Parkinson, Labourer Witness: Robert Bannister; Alice Parkinson Married by Licence by: Robert C Fletcher Rector Register: Marriages 1881 - 1909, Page 9, Entry 17 Source: LDS Film 1849640
I think that James and Hugh Bannister (groom's fathers) are brothers.
I have asked for better images of the Bannisters shown on the Eccles Wesleyan church to be sent to me to see if they can be identified as Manchester's.
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Post by Hawker Hurricane on Feb 24, 2012 23:45:57 GMT
I spent much of yesterday evening and this morning updating the database I've been compiling for SWARM with the St. Andrews men. (I had somehow missed them previously ) Quite a few of them also appear on the Eccles Wesleyan and/or Eccles St. Mary parish church memorials. Some are also on Christ Church Patricroft and Barton. One or two are even commemorated at Irlam. Sent from my LT15i using ProBoards
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mack
Second Lieutenant
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Post by mack on Feb 25, 2012 12:59:34 GMT
theres a few reasons why a man appears on two church memorials,the most common one is that the church he worshipped at,didnt have a school,so he attended the school of another local church.
mack
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Post by shred on Feb 25, 2012 21:11:31 GMT
Thanks for your thoughts guys.
I am confident that Notlaw has identified the correct Bannisters. I will be visiting the Salford History Library on Wednesday, I have made a note to see if any articles were published in the Eccles Journal as a final check.
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Post by shred on Feb 25, 2012 21:29:40 GMT
It seems that the Kay family are also commemorated on both the St Andrew's and Eccles Wesleyan memorials.
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Post by Hawker Hurricane on Feb 27, 2012 14:37:45 GMT
The entry below is copied to here by Hawker Hurricane:
Reported by notlaw on Today at 13:55 for the following reason: James Johnson - Cannot Identify - Can I offer Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Gunner Regiment/Service Royal field artillery Unit/Text: "B" Bty. 307 Bde Age 25 Date of Death: 19/02/1919 Service No: 891678 Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference I. B. 8 Cemetery: Pont-Remy British Cemetery Somme Additional Information: Son of Peter and Barbara Johnson of Eccles. Evidence: 1911 census shows Barbara Johnson Widow living at 4 Devonshire Road Eccles with 5 children including James aged 18. By 1919 he will be aged 25. 1901 Census shows family unit with Peter (Father), Barbara (Wife) and children including James. Devonshire Road is very close to St Andrew's Church.
I think this is our man
Notlaw
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Post by Hawker Hurricane on Feb 27, 2012 14:38:44 GMT
The entry below is copied to here by Hawker Hurricane:
Reported by notlaw on Today at 13:20 for the following reason: Wilfred Clayton - I have the following information Nationality: United Kingdom Regiment/Service: Royal Marine Light Infantry Age : 29 Date of Death: 5/04/1918 Service No: CH/15542 Additional Information: Son of Mrs E Clayton, 2 Irwell Grove Eccles Manchester Casualty: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference B.18 Cemetery: Englebelmer Communal cemetery Somme France Evidence: 1891 Census Shows Family Unit of Thomas (Father) EliZ (Mother) and 3 Children incl Wilfred living at 15 St Mary's St. Eccles and the family still at this address in 1901 Census. 1911 census shows Wilfred already on Board HMS Endymion 1st Class Cruiser docked at No 42 Sheerness Harbour. The family unit can be found at 116 Barton Lane Eccles in the 1911 Census. Eccles and Patricorft Journal Had the following article:- Eccles had at least one son in the successful naval engagement with the German Squadron in the North Sea on Sunday last. Corporal Wilfred Clayton, of the Royal Marines is serving on the “Indomitable,” the battle cruiser of 17,250 tons. His home is 2, Irwell Grove Eccles, and of his three brothers two have joined Kitchener’s Army, one in the Eccles Pals and the other South Lancashires. A letter from Corporal Clayton reached his mother on Sunday morning, but, of course, contained no information of the ships whereabouts. Clayton is 26 years of age and has served nine years in the service having previously been on the Lancaster, the Antrim and the Jupiter. He has done many years on foreign service, and early in life made up his mind to serve with the colours. Clayton is an old Clarendon Rd., school boy. Eccles and Patricroft Journal Friday 29th January 1915
Can I suggest this is our man
Notlaw
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